Rafting and Roughing It on the Black Canyon of the Gunnison: Part One

Black Canyon of the Gunnison River

Black Canyon of the Gunnison River

Only a handful of experiences in life—at least ones that occur over a forty-eight hour period—may be considered transformative. The below is one of mine. My journey on the Gunnison River gripped me with so much passion and awe that I’ve chosen to share it with you in its unabbreviated version. I’m posting this story in four parts. I hope you’ll be with me and enjoy it throughout.

I looked in the mirror and dabbed mascara onto my remaining lashes. I peered at myself and sighed about how much grey belied my younger-than-my-years appearance. Oh, what the heck, I thought. I carefully pulled the mascara wand through the patches of grey at my temples and along my hairline right at my part. I knew this was chance-y. Tomorrow I’d be on the river and I’d surely look ghastly with streaks of brownish-black running down the side of my face. Too bad I didn’t have waterproof mascara. Too bad I hadn’t had time to have my hair colored before it got this bad. Too bad I had to pack vanity along with me on a wilderness adventure.

My boyfriend, Steve, didn’t bother to comment on my appearance when he picked me up for our trip. But that’s fine, I really didn’t require any compliments. I knew that what mattered most to him would be that I’d get through it all O.K. I already told him that I had camped just a handful of nights in my life and that I had gone river rafting—all half-day trips—only twice. This, combined with the fact that I had a propensity for luxury hotels and only stayed with friends or family under the best of circumstances (no couch surfing, thank you very much), indicated to him that chances were I wouldn’t be much of a camper. Steve on the other hand was an expert outdoorsman. (This was revealed to me through many of his stories including one about roughing it on a surf trip in Baja for a month without having taken a single shower.)

The Peach Farm

The Peach Farm

After just over two hours of driving from Telluride, we found ourselves surrounded by an odd, lunar-like landscape outside of Delta, Colorado. It was hard to believe there was a deep, coursing river nearby since the landscape here is composed mainly of rocks, sand and barren hills. Nary a tree nor bush sprung forth from this bone-dry terrain. We turned off at the Black Canyon Anglers sign and cavorted along a dirt road a short distance until the orchards came into view. The trees appeared full with fruit. Peaches and nectarines hung from the branches like ornaments on a Christmas tree. The river meandered lazily in the distance. The lodge sat firmly at its edge skirted by flowering bushes, tall, centuries-old cottonwoods and gravely walkways that extended out to a variety of outposts including cabins, sheds and a huge garage where all the river excursions were staged.

Black Canyon Anglers Lodge

Black Canyon Anglers Lodge

Somehow it felt as though we had left the big city trappings of Telluride (Ha! How do New Yorkers feel?) and arrived at a waterside oasis. Steve and I dined with Rick, lead guide of Black Canyon Anglers (BCA), and his companion, Barbara. We exchanged pleasantries throughout the evening commenting on such things as the fine quality of the wine (a local production) and what kind of people took the river trips.

“Texans, lots of Texans,” Rick said. “But really people come from all over, mostly just to get away from it all.”

I learned that most of BCA’s river trips were for fishing, a not-so negligent fact that for me conjured up images of bunches of guys getting down and dirty in the wild. As though he was reading my thoughts, Rick began to debrief me on the upcoming two days we were to be spend on the river. Somehow Rick had been clued in that I wasn’t much of an outdoorswoman. He carefully provided a bit of an orientation, speaking slowly and softly about certain matters that he imagined might be of concern to me.

“No bears,” he quickly replied. And I could tell that with that news, even Steve breathed a sigh of relief.

“How about snakes?” I queried.

“The only one that could harm you would be the pygmy rattlesnakes,” he answered in a seemingly matter-of-fact, supposedly reassuring manner. Then he saw my jaw drop as I imagined a smallish rattler slithering toward me on the riverbanks. Somehow the stunted-growth version appeared even more horrific.

“I’ve only seen two in the sixteen years I’ve been on the river,” Rick quickly added.

Steve and I finished off our perfect evening outside in front of the fire seated on benches made of old wagon wheels with Farm Kitty, the resident fluffy, black and tan tabby, on our laps. The sound of the river whooshed in the distance. I gave little thought to what lay ahead. Tonight we’d sleep in the cabin.

Farm Kitty snuggled in with us for the night and then we all enjoyed breakfast the next morning at the same spot where we’d gazed into the fire the night before. I still felt pretty relaxed. Then it was time to sort out our belongings and pack all that we needed for two days into a dry sack, a large, elongated and totally waterproof duffel bag of sorts that would be carted along on our travels. Panic ensued as to what to bring and what to leave behind. (The idea of spending close to thirty-two hours in the wilderness with just one small bag—with access to little else—seemed daunting.) I put my padded, underwire bra aside but not my makeup case. (I didn’t plan on wearing any makeup but it just seemed too radical to part with it entirely.) Steve folded the plastified canvas bag down for me and hauled it off to the guys who were readying the van that would take us to the put-in way up the river, a distance from the lodge.

By now Glenn, a friend and business contact of Steve’s, and his twenty-something year-old daughter and graduate school student, Jennifer, had arrived. Glenn, an accountant from New Jersey, who had taken the trip eight times, was the motivating force behind our going. The heat was on for me to totally buckle everything up. I did one more bathroom stop, relishing it so much that I even sat on the seat in the public restroom at the lodge. I had already been informed about the toilet habits of the back country and I was quite sure that dealing with the lack of modern facilities would prove to be my biggest challenge. (There had been considerable talk about “the groover,” the camp toilet installation that ended up being a big topic of conversation throughout the trip. More on that later.)

The four of us, Rick, another guide, Ryan, and the driver piled into a large van that had been packed with all our stuff. We chatted convivially and snacked on freeze dried peaches from the orchard as we drove back beyond Delta toward Montrose. Here we turned off at the Gunnison Gorge Wilderness Area. We regained the lunar-like landscape of before, passing by enormous gumdrop-shaped mounds, monolithic anthills scarred with ATV and dirt bike tracks. It could have been the stageset for “Mad Max.” Farther along sage brush, pignon, juniper, cedar, cacti and sunflowers pushed through this sun-scorched earth, leaving me to believe that the river’s edge was nearing.

Approaching the Canyon

Approaching the Canyon

“We’ve got to climb up to the canyon rim there,” Rick indicated as I gazed out at this spectacular panorama of high desert landscape backdropped by the Uncompahgre Plateau and some of the most majestic peaks of the Rockies. We bumped and jostled more than half the way over the dirt road of this 45-minute drive that lead to the edge of the Black Canyon of the Gunnison. Gullies, a foot wide and just as deep, tossed our van from port to starboard, stern to aft. I prayed I didn’t have to cry out for a bathroom break since I sensed that there were surely unsavory critters lurking in this hostile environment. Finally, we arrived.

The Canyon Road---The Smooth Part!

The Canyon Road---The Smooth Part!

Mules gathered near our drop-off point, ready to descend the steep canyon yet another time so that we would only be taxed by the burden of carrying down our personal belongings, our own dry bags converted into backpacks of sorts. The driver of the van had already dropped off most of the gear for our two-day river trip the day before; this way the beasts were already packed and ready to go upon our arrival.

I switched out of my flip flops and into my sporty Ralph Lauren sneaks. I had to bother Steve with undoing my dry bag so that I could add my last-minute incidentals into the sack. He hoisted the fifty-pound satchel onto my shoulders and gathered up his own, a considerably larger load since he was also carrying our sleeping bags and pads. By now, half the crew was headed down the steep slope. Steve, Glenn and I set out along the rocky trail, a supposed fifteen-minute hike that would lead us to the base of the canyon. I gingerly stepped over, on and between the rocks, careful not to injure myself so early in the game. Steve slowed up as much as he could until I gave him the O.K. to forge forward as Glenn and I teetered along at our own secure pace. I had never hiked with such a charge and beneath the heat of the nearly noon-day sun, it was feeling as though I was lugging a hundred pounds on my back.

Glenn, a 260-pound guy, that was surely in no better shape than I, huffed and puffed the whole way down. Except for the fact that I worried about what to do if he expired, I took solace in this—it was nice to have someone in sync with me.

“There’s no need to go any faster,” he exclaimed wryly. “The sooner we arrive, the more work we’ll have to do.” Boy was I beginning to love this guy. I knew from the get-go that I’d fare O.K. on this trip with Glenn along.

The distant clinking and clanking of the animals finally caught up with us and then we let them pass. These hard-working beasts descended (and ascended!) this rugged trail, loaded down with recreationalists’ wares, two to three times a day. I spotted a neatly folded rubber raft on one of the animal’s backs, the frame for the boat on another’s, while another one of these kind-faced mules was loaded down with coolers and other random supplies. No wonder these river trips were so expensive. The horse packers themselves required a good amount of compensation for their efforts.

“Let’s wait a while for the air to clear,” I yelled to Glenn, as I choked on the stream of gas that trailed the animals down the mountain.

“Good idea,” he shouted back in his thick Jersey accent. “Remember there’s no need to go any faster.”

Glenn told me “it’s right around the corner” at least three times before he, too, seemed frustrated that we weren’t there yet. Rick appeared, offering to carry one of our sacks. Glenn quickly turned his over and gave me a droll smile, saying “age before beauty.” That was fine by me since I didn’t think having Steve see Rick show up with my bag was a good way to start the trip. I knew that Steve would be hoping for more than that from me.

Once at the beach (about a half hour from the start of the hike), we all gathered beneath the shade of a clump of trees while Rick and Ryan proceeded to blow up the rafts, place the frames, load the coolers, dry bags and a plethora of other stuff that was surely essential for two fun and safe days on the river. Squashed into our life vests with paddles in hand, we were finally ready to board the raft. (All four of us traveled with Rick, while Ryan navigated alone with the gear.) I requested one more look into my dry bag and fished out a sunscreen and lip balm that I tucked into the pockets of my quick-dry shorts. I nervously watched as my dry bag was buckled down into Ryan’s boat. Steve and company couldn’t help teasing me about separation anxiety about my stuff. I made a mental note to bring a purse-sized dry bag with me (in my boat) if ever I was to do this trip again.

The Put-In

The Put-In

Thank you to Ryan Gluek and Black Canyon Anglers for the above images.

Top Chef’s Kelly Liken: Making Colorado Proud

Kelly Liken:  Frontier Spirit Meets Eastern Know-How

Chef Kelly Liken: Frontier Spirit Meets Eastern Know-How

I chatted with cheftestant extraordinaire, Kelly Liken, yesterday, during a Travel Fun interview.  It was the day after Bravo’s Top Chef finale and Kelly was finally able to breath a sigh of relief and talk openly and candidly about her Top Chef experience. Right off she revealed to me that Bravo’s newest Top Chef, Kevin Sbraga, was her choice for winner—aside from herself of course. Throughout the interview, Kelly sounds exhilarated by her whole Top Chef experience. And why wouldn’t she? She emerged from a pool of seventeen cheftestants to make her way among the final four (and the only woman to boot!) to the penultimate episode in Singapore.  Indeed she has made Colorado proud.

Back in April I had the pleasure of dining in Kelly’s namesake restaurant in Vail. I was told at the time that she was away.  When she showed up on Top Chef D.C., I realized that that’s where she was, a T.V. adventure that lasted over thirty days, concluding with some ten days in Singapore.  When asked what she liked most about the experience, Kelly expressed her contentment with working so closely with the other chefs, revealing to me that they actually got along quite well.  As for what she liked least, it comes as no surprise that she felt sleep deprived for the better part of the month.

Click on the play button below to hear more about what Kelly has to say about her Top Chef participation and her special relationship with Colorado.

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Kelly's Signature Rocky Mountain Trout

Kelly's Signature Rocky Mountain Trout

If you’re anywhere near Atlanta next Friday, September 24, consider attending the Celebrity Chef Tour, an exciting event benefiting the James Beard Foundation.  Kelly will be putting on a fine meal along with Kenny Gilbert, another Top Chef contestant that also has ties to Colorado.  Go to Likin’ Kelly Liken to read more about Kelly and Kelly Liken, her Vail Village restaurant.

Kelly Liken, Vail, Colorado

Kelly Liken, Vail, Colorado

Summer Sipping

Harvest Time at Sutcliffe Vineyards in Southwestern Colorado

Harvest Time at Sutcliffe Vineyards in Southwestern Colorado

I’m trying not to feel sad about summer’s end. As much as I love each season, it’s always hard to let them go—at least that’s the case for summer and winter here in Colorado. I’m already nostalgic about my summer. Yet I’m also determined to extend it, something that’s not so hard to do when the desert beckons just a short distance away. (I’m in the throes of planning a trip to Monument Valley, Grand Canyon and southern Utah for October, so I’m not putting my cotton T-shirts and flip flops away just yet.)

Almost more than anything else, I often identify my seasons with the food and wine I’ve savored during that time. (Indeed I am a gourmand.) And this summer more than before, I find myself associating certain wines with certain events. In some cases the wine was most memorable; in other cases it was the event. In all cases, both seemed to have a synergistic effect that has prompted me to remember both the event and the wine all the more intensely. My reminiscing of summer sipping goes as follows:

Sunset Concert Series

Encantado:  A Mouthful of Summer All Year Long

Encantado: A Mouthful of Summer All Year Long

Like many cities across America, almost every mountain town holds a weekly summer concert where locals and visitors alike can enjoy great music—from bluegrass to rock—against the backdrop of spectacular mountain scenery. In Telluride, our Sunset Concert Series takes place annually in Mountain Village all of July and August on Wednesday nights from six to eight p.m. People cart in their lawn chairs, spread out a picnic and enjoy the alpenglow, serenaded by all kinds of fun music. I wasn’t much on preparing a picnic this year and instead ordered up fine European pizzas from the nearby Italian restaurant. I did bring some delightful wines though including Concannon’s Righteously Rosé that I picked up at a local wine shop. What a way to kick off the first concert and what a find! Modestly priced at just over $10., this wine ranked as high as some of my most memorable rosés de Provence. This set me off on a Concannon spree which included most notably a creamy, buttery Chardonnay from Livermore Valley, just the sort of oaky California Chard that’s perfect year-round. At least for me anyway. Summer means rosé, so of course I celebrated the last Sunset Concert of the year with Encantado, a beautiful, salmon-colored nectar. This delicious rosé from California left me singing its praises while the sky also turned an exquisite peachy-pink as the sun set over the mountains.

Pine Ridge: A Sure Bet

The Tour de France
How I love to watch the Tour de France.  And it’s sometimes more fun to take in the big mountain stages with friends. I brought a bottle of Pine Ridge Chenin Blanc-Viognier over to a friend’s place for one of the Pyrenées stages. We all marveled at this delicious wine that combines the honeyed fruit of Chenin Blanc with the light floral aromas and fruit notes of Viognier. It served as both an impressive gift and the perfect accompaniment to a mid-summer’s repast of cheese, salad and assorted hors d’oeuvres.  My friend smiled approvingly at my choice of wine, reminding me that Pine Ridge, a Napa Valley Winery, is a much-appreciated sponsor of the Telluride Film Festival, a crowd that consistently shows good taste.  Upon hearing this, I picked up two more bottles of Pine Ridge whites to enjoy throughout the rest of the Tour:  a Chardonnay and a Sauvignon Blanc.  What a Champs-Elysées finish!

Dinners at Home

I love enjoying a nice meal at home whether I’m sharing it with a friend (usually my hunny) or relishing one on my couch before I pull out my laptop to write. The French in me makes sure that I always serve up something tasty, a relatively easy feat in summer when fruits and vegetables delight the palate with full and luscious flavor. Monsoon season besieged us with a spate of chilly evenings, welcome relief nonetheless from some super hot days. And suddenly we had more good reasons to drink red wine! One remarkable dinner at home consisted of a plate of pasta buried beneath a thick mantle of homemade Bolognese sauce (made from ground buffalo). A Colorado wine, a superb Cabernet Sauvignon, from Sutcliffe Vineyards, accompanied it magnificently. Located in southwestern Colorado, this vineyard consistently produces memorable wines that embody all the sunshine and might of the Rocky Mountains. Good news: You can book a stay at the vineyard and make it your base for visiting renowned sites such as Mesa Verde in the region. Or, you can just kick back and gaze out over the vines.

A Picnic with Friends

Octavin Home Wine Bar

Octavin Home Wine Bar

In Colorado, people are big on potlucks, a totally new concept to me up until I arrived here nearly nine years ago. In France, people take turns giving dinner parties. It’s rare that they join together to offer up the components of a meal—such a disorganized approach to assembling a feast is almost unthinkable to the French. When I don’t have time to cook, I’ll usually bring a couple of bottles of wine. I found a terrific “bottle” that ended up being the talk of the party. Have you ever heard of Octavin Home Wine Bar? Have you ever seen wine in a cardboard box? Well these eight-sided nifty cardboard packages stand out amongst the ranks of boxed wines. (I got thirsty, however, trying to pull out the spout. But then again, I never was very mechanical.) The Octavin I came across contained a crisp, Sauvignon Blanc from Silver Birch World Wines in Marlborough, New Zealand. Its attractive turquoise-blue box made an impression from the get-go.  (Better yet, I learned afterward that Octavin’s innovative packaging prevents oxidation.  This means that you can enjoy a glass, as fresh and flavorful as the first served, up to six weeks after opening it.  Also, Octavin contains the equivalent of four bottles of wine yet you usually end up paying the price of just three. Wow!)

My Birthday
O.K., so now you know. I like my wine to have a little cache, especially when it comes to the packaging and label. It just makes it fun. I learned this summer—I think on a Today Show episode—that the oh-so fabulous Biltmore estate produces wine. With a facade of equal grandeur of the most renowned châteaux of the Loire, my curiosity piqued. Then I discovered that a Frenchman, a certain Bernard Delille, works at the Biltmore as winemaster. Mon dieu! Say no more. I procured a bottle of their bubbly (their Biltmore Estate Blanc de Blancs Méthode Champenoise – Brut, to be exact) and popped it on my b-day at the end of August. Délicieux, nice and dry and slightly floral with notes of lemon and apricot. Now I just have to find my way to this incomparable establishment in North Carolina sometime soon. Vive l’influence française en Amérique!

The Biltmore Winery

The Biltmore Winery

Summer Harvest

I had earmarked a bottle of Sutcliffe Chardonnay to accompany one of my best meals of the summer, composed of chanterelle fettucine, sweet Olathe corn, a tomato and mozzarella salad and a peach/raspberry combo. (We have some of the best mushrooms, corn and peaches in Colorado.) At the market I spotted a bunch of fresh clams in the fish case, a rarity in our remote mountain town. With a guarantee they were fresher than fresh, I snatched them up, steamed them and uncorked my bottle of Sutcliffe Chard the night before my summer harvest dinner. The rich, full-bodied taste of this wine perfectly accompanied my briny clams dipped in melted butter. I felt in heaven at more than 9,500 feet. Fortunately I’m not much of a lush, so there was enough left over to go with my last special meal of the summer. (Thankfully I shared it with just one other person and my leftover wine worked out since we served gin and tonics beforehand.) It’s hard not to finish off a good bottle of wine, but you always have to think about getting up in the morning.

So there’s my summer for you. I surely missed some special nectars and memories in the above account, but you get the gist of it. I certainly had fun. This weekend Telluride will be going off with the Blues & Brews Festival. I only plan to attend the last day and as the festival suggests, I’ll be happy with the hops at that event. It doesn’t look like I’ll be imbibing in any more memorable wines before the close of the summer.

Thank goodness I have fall and all those jammy reds, fruity Beaujolais and dry pinots to look forward to in my sipping program. One thing’s for sure though: I know I’ll carry on with some light and bright summer whites as well as some dry rosés because they’ll continue to go well with many of the foods I enjoy.

Plus I’m determined to keep that summer mode going, at least a good ways into autumn.

This just in: The 17th annual Telluride Blues & Brews Festival will be putting on a free Sunset Blues Concert, featuring Matt Schofield and Gold Kings, in Telluride Mountain Village tomorrow, Thursday, September 16 from 5 to 7 p.m. Dang! I better round up a nice bottle of wine.

Terrific Travel Advice from Everett Potter

Everett Potter:  The Guy in the Know When It Comes to Travel

Everett Potter: The Guy in the Know When It Comes to Travel

I recently did a Travel Fun interview with top travel writer, Everett Potter, and boy did we have fun trading stories about the travel world. Everett, a travel writer for over twenty-five years, may easily be considered one of the country’s foremost authorities on travel. He’s a regular contributor to many illustrious travel publications including Ski Magazine, Forbes Life and Travel & Leisure.  He launched an online newsletter and blog, Everett Potter’s Travel Report, a handful of years ago, a logical outgrowth to all the information he amasses from his freelance assignments.

So here we are—two bloggers that have been published in various outlets aside from the worldwide web. You’ve got to hear what we say about this new world of travel writing, a world largely dominated by the Internet where anyone can self publish their thoughts and opinions without the careful eye of an editor.  ”A lot of the blogosphere has stories completely unedited, not fact checked,” Everett points out.  Facebook and Twitter are mentioned in the same breath as remarks about the constant changes of travel writing online and off.

We discuss TripAdvisor in far greater detail, weighing the pros and cons of this Internet phenomenon that often leaves hotel G.M.s and other hospitality industry heavyweights cringing with every other posting.  Of course many of the critiques ring legitimate, others not so much.  ”There’s an awful lot of English people lamenting the fact that there’s not a tea kettle in their room,” Everett says.  I chuckle and sympathize with these complaints since being a tea drinker myself, it’s truly awful to make tea in a coffee pot.

Everett also talks about how and where to find the most value for your travel dollars, how to book hotels and flights, today’s lodging and airline cutbacks and much more. Don’t plan your next trip without listening to this interview!

I bet Everett would be tons of fun to be with on a trip, especially to a place such as England.  You can do just that September 26-October 3 on a Dartmoor to Exmoor Walk, a soft adventure walking tour, organized by The Wayfarers.  There are still some places left, but act fast!

You’ll find a wealth of stories on food and wine, culture, adventure travel and more at Everett’s blog.  There you can also toss your hat (or e-mail address) into the ring for a variety of contests he offers on a regular basis.  They’re downright giveaways, in fact, where you can snag a hotel stay, cruise and more.

Sit down with a good cup of tea or a glass of wine and listen to all that Everett and I have to say about today’s wonderful and crazy world of travel.  Click on the play button below to begin.

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Dear Money: An Interview with Martha McPhee

Dear Money:  A Great Story of Our Times

Dear Money: A Great Story of Our Times

Oh dear, I need money.  Such is the plight of all writers, unless you’re independently wealthy or you’re among the few to achieve John Grisham-like success.  There isn’t a writer on this earth—published or nonpublished—that couldn’t identify with the struggles of India Palmer, the main character and narrator in Martha McPhee‘s recently-released novel, “Dear Money.”  And I’m one of them!

In this beautifully crafted fourth novel, Martha reveals the travails of India from the angst over paying bills, to the challenges of “keeping up with the Jones,” to the long hours a dedicated writer must log at her desk (sunny days and all) and much more.  Clearly Martha, a highly-acclaimed writer that happens to live in New York city like her protagonist, has drawn from personal experience to spin this exciting tale of a cash-strapped writer that’s tempted by the allure of a more high rolling life in the Big Apple.  India ends up doing the unthinkable:  She trades her artist’s life to become a bond trader.  Funnily enough the idea behind the novel comes from a real-life offer.  A legendary bond trader did claim that he could transform Martha into a booming Wall Street success in eighteen months; fortunately for us she declined and wrote “Dear Money” instead.  It’s not surprising to learn from the intricately-detailed passages written about the highly competitive and adrenaline-charged life among New York’s financiers that Martha shadowed a bond trader to learn the ins and outs of mortgage-backed securities during the height of its rise.  I found the contrasts between the writer’s life and the financier’s life to be one of the most compelling parts of this book.

Sweet Martha

Sweet Martha

You may be wondering why I’ve taken such an interest in Martha and her work.  As usual, serendipity played a hand in our connecting with each other.  I actually skied with her, her family and some friends of hers last March in Telluride. We both shared that we were writers but little else about our work was discussed. Since it was the height of the busy season, I didn’t find a moment to Google her.  I feel as though I really came to know Martha after she sent me “Dear Money” later on in the spring, especially because it’s a book that has resonated so much with my writer’s life (sans the bond trader dimension, of course).  Now perhaps the next time we ride the chairlift together we’ll shed our squirrel-y shyness about our work (seemingly a classic character trait of writers) and get down to some real exchanges about the creative process.

It looks as though that just might happen since plans are in the works for Martha to give a presentation at the Wilkinson Public Library in Telluride next March.  I’m vying for that program to include a writer’s workshop, too!

If you’re a writer, you must listen to the Travel Fun interview I conducted with Martha earlier this summer. Avid readers will love it as well.  And how’s that pile of summer reading doing at your bedside?  I bet it has dwindled but if you’re like me, you feel like you’re just warming up. Keep adding to the stack and continue that summer reading mode all year long.  I provide some great reading suggestions at the end of this interview that will steer you toward more excellent book picks, both fiction and nonfiction.

Click on the play button below to listen to my interview with Martha.

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